MDAO Forum

Support for People with Mood Disorders => General Discussion => Topic started by: Dragonfly on March 04, 2017, 10:29:04 am

Title: I was very, very angry with my two daughters yesterday
Post by: Dragonfly on March 04, 2017, 10:29:04 am
I was trying to visit with my two daughters yesterday. I got really, really angry at them. They were both on their cell phones looking up information, on facebook, etc.

I know there was another issue underneath the anger I felt with my girls. I spoke earlier in my post about my son who is separated from his wife and her brother committed suicide. I knew the deceased and his family well. We camped with them.

I was trying to talk myself into going to the visitation yesterday afternoon to support my son and grandchildren. I felt guilty. I saw my son's ex earlier that day and I told her I was very sorry about her brother's death. I told her how close I had been to suicide one time. Not to blame herself nor should her family. Her brother was in so much pain and considered himself worthless and a burden to his family. She asked if their was any grievance conselling and I said the funeral home could provide that.

I think I am so upset because it is bringing back all the times when I was extremely depressed and had suicidal ideas. One suicidal sttempt but a cry for help. And another upsetting thing is that the deceased is having visitation and service at the funeral home where my late husband's funeral was. More memories and how much I miss him. I can't seem to stop crying.

I feel like a hypocrite. The deceased was very mentally ill like I have been in the past. I just can't seem to accept his immature and spoiled behaviour. Very disrespectfull (can't seem to spell properly), immoral actions, bragging, very loud and full of himself. Behind all this a very low self esteem.  These behaviors are the very opposite to the way my family things. The parents enabled this. I don't have much respect for the whole family. I believe I am now being very judgemental.

My daughters tell me I should forget about how that family acts and not worry about it. Of course, worried about the influence they have on my grandchildren. My daughters, my son and and I  with love and care for them and will  instill as much as possible for them to be moral and  to treat people the way they would want to be treated. My youngest daughter makes this statement all the time.

Well it is time to start thinking positive again and move on. I know I am not supose to apologize for the long post. Thanks for reading it.

Title: Re: I was very, very angry with my two daughters yesterday
Post by: Stenacron man on March 04, 2017, 05:40:05 pm
It will take awhile to get passed this situation. Try to find a girl not on her phone doing social media. We always miss a good thing when its gone. One day they will wake up and say where did the time go. I haven't had a cell phone since 2009 and I have no need at this time.

Buddy Mack.
Title: Re: I was very, very angry with my two daughters yesterday
Post by: paulm on March 05, 2017, 01:21:54 am
Hello Dragonfly. I'm starting this reply for the fourth time. If we were in person I would have no problem telling you what I think, but electronically it is so hard to convey the proper words.

 I think that you are being too hard on yourself. You have had a lot happen in the last yr or so . Your son got separated, you've had health problems, you are worried about your family and your own health, you've thought about changing doctors and now a suicide. Plus probably a lot of other stuff that I don't know about. All of that would make me a little touchy at times.

 You say that you are being very judgmental.  Everybody is judgmental in some way. When we are upset we all tend to get more judgmental.  It is very easy for me to forget that once upon a time hardly anyone would talk to me because I wasn't a very good person.  It's easy for me to say that they should have taken my illness into consideration, but in those days that just wasn't done.  Besides, back then I wouldn't have talked to someone like me if the roles were reversed. I'm not proud of that, but it was a fact in my younger days.

 Whenever I do start getting too judgmental these days I just have to remember that if my wife had left me and took the kids, who knows where I would have ended up , assuming I was still alive. In those days it was easy for a spouse to get a separation and sole custody of the kids if there was a mental illness involved and if a suicide attempt was involved then the person was lucky if they even got visiting rights with their kids. I was very very lucky that my wife did not leave me when I needed her the most. Otherwise instead of typing here I would be lying on a subway grate asking for spare change(at best).

 It's hard to know just how much influence we have over our kids and whether or not we enable certain behaviours.  My wife grew up with a family that drank hard, smoked a ton and for the most part swore like I never heard before. Yet my wife doesn't drink or smoke and the next time I hear her swear will be the first time I ever heard her swear.  Sometimes she jokes that she must have been adopted because she is so different from her family. (she had 7 siblings). 

 On the other hand she tended to be too soft on our kids because she had it so hard when she was younger.   So your daughter is right, all you can do is your best and hope for the best. I certainly put my parents through some tortures and they never enabled me to do anything.

 Because of the large # of people that I know and my wife's huge extended family I have to attend about 1/2 dozen funerals or visitations a yr. I seldom go to the funeral and I stay at the visitation the least amount of time that I can. On Wed I went to one. I spoke with the husband, expressed my condolences, spoke briefly with one nephew , signed the visitation book and then I was out of there, even though I knew the deceased well. I just can't handle that sort of thing and I make no apologies.  When I go, there will be a celebration of life at a convient time, no line up to express condolences and no service. There wouldn't even be that but I know that the family needs to have closure.

 Please try and not to be so hard on yourself. I tend to be my own worse critic these days and I know that helps no one, least of all me.

 In regards to morales all we can do is try and instill basic morales in our kids. Society morales tend to change over time and often our societies leaders tend to do a lousy job of being moral themselves.  Take Care. paul m P.S. Let me know if you ever figure out a way to get cell phones out of people's hands. I can't get my own kids to put theirs down.
Title: Re: I was very, very angry with my two daughters yesterday
Post by: Dragonfly on March 07, 2017, 10:07:08 pm
Hi Paul, Thank you for your kinds words and caring. You are my true friend here.

I hope that I am getting some of this right. As you say do we really enable our kids to be a certain way. My son was very wild when he was in his teen years and into his early twenties. I don't think either my husband and I did anything to make him act this way. Fortunately he has become a very responsible person.

It is very interesting what you say about the people that brought your wife up and that she certainly did not become like the rest of her family.

Paul I think you under estimate yourself. Your wife sounds like a really good person. Don't count yourself out. You have some very good qualities even though you have a mental illness otherwise your wife wouldn't have stuck with you.

I have been told many times that I am too hard on myself. You are right it doesn't help me or others.

I want to change the subject. I know you have problems. Your health is not that good. How are you coping with everything.

Do we become stronger because we have this mental illness? Can we empathize more with people? You do a lot of work related to mental illness. Would you have done this if you weren't mentally ill? I hope you don't mind me delving into your affairs.

I notice that you had a hard time replying to me. Do not worry I will not take things wrong that you write to me. I also question what I write a great deal of the time.


Title: Re: I was very, very angry with my two daughters yesterday
Post by: paulm on March 09, 2017, 07:20:39 am
Hello Dragonfly. I don't mind answering those questions, but I'm at the end of an 8 hr shift at the distress centre and I'm a little too tired to give you a sensible answer, so I will try and reply in the next 24 hrs. I've got about 10 mintues to go and then it's home to bed for a while. Take Care. paul m
Title: Re: I was very, very angry with my two daughters yesterday
Post by: Dragonfly on March 09, 2017, 07:57:20 pm
Do not worry Paul. You were doing a great thing. I am not always on the forum. Have a good rest.

Title: Re: I was very, very angry with my two daughters yesterday
Post by: paulm on March 11, 2017, 02:49:13 am
Hello Again Dragonfly.  How am I coping with everything health wise?  Pretty well. My biggest challenges seem to be trying to keep decent timing with my activities. That is I have to make a greater effort to make sure that I eat right and sleep right.

 Sleep is a major problem because of the un controlled movements that Parkinson's sometimes causes me in my sleep and between the arthritis and Parkinson's sometimes the pain keeps me from sleeping too well.

 I've been offered narcotics by several doctors and I've turned them down so far as the pain isn't that bad most days, it just gets in the way of sleeping sometimes. So I get up and type LOL. Of course during the winter I  tend to get S.A.D. that turns into depression, but I've been working on that and so far the depression hasn't deepened this winter. Of course one of the symptoms of S.A.D. is a carving for carbohydrates and then it's a battle to keep away from the fats and sugars as they don't do my type 2 diabetes any good.

  Would I have done all of the volunteer work that I do with mental illness if I hadn't became ill myself? Probably not, but I would still have volunteered a lot, probably just as much, just in other ways. My parents instilled in me that I should help others from an early age. 

 I used to do a lot of volunteering with kids, scout leader, hockey coach etc, however that became impossible during the time that I became a community outcast. So I started volunteering in the mental health sector and I've been doing increasing amounts as my health permits. 

 Do we become stronger because we have a mental illness? Everybody is different, however I was pretty strong before I got really ill and I don't think my mental illness added any overall strenth. It did prepare me to take on my other challanges later in life(parkinson's arthritis and so on) and to have a better out look on my life when misfortune comes my way. So I guess in that way it did strengthen me. 

 Am I more emphatic because I have a mental illness? I would say definitely and that would also include anyone who has a major problem, mentally, physically, addiction etc.

 I'm also a lot more tolerant about mistakes others make due to their major problems I have nothing but praise and sympathy for someone who tries whether they succeed or fail.  However I am human and because of my own struggles I find it hard to be sympathetic to people who won't try, especially when some one has the resources that were denied to me, but won't use them. (and denied to many others)   I still work at being non judgemental, but I often fail. Take Care. paul m
Title: Re: I was very, very angry with my two daughters yesterday
Post by: Dragonfly on March 13, 2017, 11:58:41 am
Hi Paul,  Thanks for sharing with me. Just looked out my window and it is snowing like anything. I guess the predicted storm is coming in. Sorry I got side tracked.
You seem to be taking your health problems in stride. I am trying to do that too. I have been told that I have nauropathy in my hands and feet. The doctors say I may also have arthritis in my right arm and wrist. What does arthristis feel like to you?
It is great that you volunteer. I always wanted to when my kids were in school but then I got sick. My husband was very helpful to people. Most of his family was like that too.
I do have more empathy for people because of my mental illness.
I used to be very shy and anxious when I was young. Now I listen and talk to strangers. When I am shopping, waiting for a doctor's appointment, etc. I enjoy hearing what people have to say. Sometimes you can really identify with what they say. You learn so much.
I must say that I do feel it such a waste of a life as to what the person I talked about before who took his own life. My family has known him for about 20 years. This person was uncle to my grandchildren as I have probably mentioned. I did not go to the funeral. My son had to because of the kids. He was extremely upset. He was in such anguish because his daughter cried so much for her uncle. She is a very sensitive, kind girl.
I hope that I haven't made this reply to you all about me.

Title: Re: I was very, very angry with my two daughters yesterday
Post by: paulm on March 21, 2017, 12:10:28 am
Hello Dragonfly. What does my arthritis feel like to me?  Depends on what part is hurting LOL. My knees and ankles are much better now that I have lost weight and the medication has helped a lot too.

 The arthritis in my spine is a different matter. When it decides to flare up, I am bed ridden or move at a snails pace until the inflammation goes down. We were in Ottawa a couple of yrs ago and we got to the motel and I couldn't move to get out of the van. I had to sit there for a couple of hrs applying heat (hot water bottle ) and eating aspirins just so I could go in and lie down.  Fortunately it does not flare up too often.

 In regards to funerals: I hate going to funerals in the following order: 1) children's, 2) Sudden death, i.e. car accidents, suicides 3) all other types. 

 All deaths of young people are a waste, suicide included.  I feel very sad that all of that potential is wasted.

 In regard to your Grandaughter, it would hurt to read the following    and     The articles address two key fears that children have.

 1) Will that happen to someone else I love? (a common thought in youth)

 2)Sometimes children understand things wrong like:" I wished that he hadn't been so mean to mean the other day and I wished that he would just go away" I didn't mean for him to die.

 I'm not saying that your Granddaughter will think either thought, but it doesn't hurt to read a bit about how children process death and possibly talk with them. 

 I hope that your whole family is able to let this unfortunate happening pass without too much more grief. However if someone does need extra help, your son's benefit package may include grief counselling and you can also call 211 and ask what grief counselling is available in your area. Take Care. Paul M
Title: Re: I was very, very angry with my two daughters yesterday
Post by: Dragonfly on March 24, 2017, 10:43:44 am
Hi Paul,
 I empathize with you about your arthritis. As mentioned by two doctors and my pharmacist I seem to have at the moment arthritis in my wrist, hands and arm. They advised me to take tylenol morning, noon and before bed as it flares up. Also to do exercises. I am advised not to take advil or aspirins.

It seems to me that my granddaughter is coping alright with the death of her uncle. I have read the articles that you posted. Thank you. I will make sure to address any fears and questions that my granddaughter has.


Title: Re: I was very, very angry with my two daughters yesterday
Post by: paulm on March 25, 2017, 08:31:09 am
Hello Dragonfly. I'm glad that your Granddaughters are coping well. I thank you for the information about what you take for arthritis.

 Tylenol is very good at killing the pain, but I will get up on my soap box a bit and talk about the usage of Tylenol vs aspirin especially for those of us taking lithium and or having liver problems .  I am not a medical qualified person and I know that there are many reasons not to take aspirin, however if some one is told , don't take it because they are taking lithium and that is the only reason, chances they are being misinformed.

 Most doctors and most pharmacists say "don't take aspirin if you take lithium"  As aspirin is far more effective at controlling inflammation than Tylenol , aspirin is usually the medication to use. However for some reason most docs and most pharmacists have not read all of the latest studies which shows that aspirin does not affect affect the lithium levels in the average person.

 From "Most studies have shown that aspirin and other salicylates do not significantly affect the serum concentrations of lithium. In general, no particular precaution should be necessary when lithium is coadministered with salicylates." 

 Aspirin usually has a better effect on arthritis as aspirin has anti inflammatory effects and Tylenol does not. For those of us with arthritis, we want to keep the inflammation down as well a kill the pain. 

 Tylenol can be extra ordinarily hard on your liver and over dosing can be very easy. Tylenol's own website shows that we should not take more than 3000 mg per day    however as Tylenol arthritis contains 650mg of medication and the recommended maximum dose is 6 pills at 650mg each per day, and that equals 3900 mg per day, I don't understand how they can say it's good to take that much. Even 6 doses of extra strength Tylenol per day maxes a person out at 3000 mg per day and those with impaired livers are told not to take that much, but yet doctors continually say take Tylenol for arthritis!!! 

 Also as Tylenol is in many other products it is easy to go over the maximum daily dose.

 There is nothing wrong with taking tylenol, but according to  "  In the United States, acetaminophen toxicity has replaced viral hepatitis as the most common cause of acute hepatic failure and is the second most common cause of liver failure requiring transplantation."

 So if you are taking tylenol 3 times a day you might want to calculate your daily dosage and if near 3000mg, talk to your doctor about it.  I'm not recommending either product, I'm just using this chance to tell people just to be extra careful when using tylenol. Take Care. paul m
Title: Re: I was very, very angry with my two daughters yesterday
Post by: Dragonfly on March 25, 2017, 03:49:57 pm
Hi Paul,

Thank you for the information on tylenol and aspirin. I have already thought about it. I am not going to follow the pharmacists recommendation of taking tylenol 3 times a day for arthritic pain.

It is interesting that you mention the fact that aspirin controls inflammation better than tylenol. When I was younger I used to get migraine headaches. I found that aspirin would work much better for me than tylenol. I was not on lithium then or any other drugs and did not have the health problems that I have now. For some reason I do not have those headaches anymore.

I am no longer on lithium. I got off it because of my kidneys. Lamotrigne seems to be keeping my bipolar in check plus other psychiatric drugs. That does not mean that this drug would be effective for other people.

I am glad that you mentioned the fact that aspirin works better than tylenol. Maybe I am not suppose to take aspirin because of my other health problems. I am going to look into that.

I guess I should again question the pharmacist as to why I cannot take aspirin. They know I am no longer on lithium,

Title: Re: I was very, very angry with my two daughters yesterday
Post by: Dragonfly on March 25, 2017, 04:00:10 pm
Hi Paul,

   I did some research on the internet. I believe I cannot take aspirin because of my chronic kidney disease. I have made an appointment with my doctor about my arthritic pain this coming Friday. I keep wanting to cancel it. I probably should go.

Title: Re: I was very, very angry with my two daughters yesterday
Post by: paulm on March 27, 2017, 10:45:21 pm
Hello Dragonfly.  You should keep your doctors appt and also ask what they think is best for the pain. Some people with kidney disease certainly cannot take aspirin, but part of that depends on what type of kidney disease it is and how severe it is.  Your doctor should know best.

 I'm glad that  Lamotrigne is working well for you. It's funny how psychiatric medications affect so many people differently. When I tried Lamotrigne for all the good it did me I may as well have taken smarties LOL.

 In regards to migraines. For yrs my wife suffered from migraines (and it wasn't me causing them LOL). She tried everything that the doctors told her to try, some medication would help make them less severe, but nothing solved them.

 Then one day her dentist asked her if she suffered from migraines and she said yes. He said that it was possible because she had never had braces and her upper and lower teeth were misaligned. He said that a simple mouthguard might work He made up a simple mouth guard that snaps onto her teeth (it's small, clear and she can wear it in public without most people noticing) and she hasn't had a migraine since (that was over 20 yrs ago). She wears it at night and sometimes during the day if she is feeling tense.

 I use this as an example of how misleading the internet or even doctors can be. If you ck the Mayo Clinic website or Web MD, both respected sites, neither will mention using a specialized mouth guard as a possible option. They only suggest medication, relaxation techniques and avoiding certain foods. However if you google: Can a mouth guard help with migraines? You will get all sorts of dental sites suggesting using a variety of mouth guard remedies. 

 A mouth guard will not help all people with migraines, but my wife was highly ticked off when she discovered that she had suffered all of those yrs and not one doctor had suggested a mouth guard as a remedy.

 Anyways, I've said enough. Good luck with your arthritis(and other things too). Take Care. paul m